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Imperials or Stormcloaks, what one?
- Thread starter EvilCrazyCows
- Start date
Dagmar
Defender of the Bunnies of Skyrim
No I didn't. There's absolutely nothing in what I said that implies that or from which any rational individual would infer that.
J
Jeremius
Guest
then is there any evidence to show that the Empire can defeat the Thalmor? Because I can't truly see anything, in the lore or the "wisdom" of the fanatics that post here.
Squirrel_killer-
The blade in the dark and the hand at your throat
The Empire managed to fight the Dominion to a stale mate, which shows both forces are roughly equal in strength, and it is quite obvious that even if the Empire's ultimate victory was extremely less likely, than it would take complete idiot not to see that without Skyrim those chances are even less.
Dagmar
Defender of the Bunnies of Skyrim
Again this is a straw man argument. In case you don't understand what that means, a straw man is a fallacy in logic where one attempts to create the illusion of having refuted a proposition by replacing it with a superficially similar yet unequivalent proposition (the "straw man"), and to refute it, without ever having actually refuted the original position. The proposition is and remains that the Empire with Skyrim has a better chance of defending itself against the Aldmeri Dominion. You've once again failed to address let alone refute this proposition. The latter isn't even feasible and to attempt to do so only implies an inability to understand the basic workings of arithmetic.
J
Jeremius
Guest
Again this is a straw man argument. In case you don't understand what that means, a straw man is a fallacy in logic where one attempts to create the illusion of having refuted a proposition by replacing it with a superficially similar yet unequivalent proposition (the "straw man"), and to refute it, without ever having actually refuted the original position. The proposition is and remains that the Empire with Skyrim has a better chance of defending itself against the Aldmeri Dominion. You've once again failed to address let alone refute this proposition. The latter isn't even feasible and to attempt to do so only implies an inability to understand the basic workings of arithmetic.
I am simply asking for evidence that the Empire can DEFEAT the Aldmeri Dominion, as in, They can take on the Dominion and win, not that they cannot defend themselves. Y'know, Fighting to a stalemate=Succeeding to defend oneself, but taking an more dangerous enemy on and beating them with an acceptable amount of Casualties is defeating them.
Squirrel_killer-
The blade in the dark and the hand at your throat
Once again, not the argument.
J
Jeremius
Guest
I did not think I was arguing, simply asking a question. Am I missing an argument I am not in?
If there is not an answer to the question "Can the Empire DEFEAT the Aldmeri Dominion?" then just say so...
Squirrel_killer-
The blade in the dark and the hand at your throat
As things stand it's 50/50 since we just don't know enough about inside the Aldmeri Dominion at this time.
J
Jeremius
Guest
was that so hard? That was all I needed, just to know that there is not reason to join any CW faction besides fanatical ones.
Squirrel_killer-
The blade in the dark and the hand at your throat
I was looking through the Lore to determine what was known of the Dominions inner workings, however it is well known that any army stands a lowered chance of success the smaller it is. Chance of success is proportionate to the size of the force. So I really still fail to see your logic.
J
Jeremius
Guest
My logic was that I would not choose a side until I knew one side or the other could actually defeat the Dominion, nothing more, simple question requiring a simple answer. And any reason that is given in this thread is little more than a fanatic position, backed by lore or not.
Squirrel_killer-
The blade in the dark and the hand at your throat
I mean I fail to see how it's an fanatic position (other than Raijin). In reality both sides have some chance of defeating the Dominion do to the possibility of the Dominion making fatal flaws in their reasoning, however the Empire, even without Skyrim, holds the better chance of success between the two. However, without Skyrim as part of the Empire its chances of success are lessened greatly. That is basic math.
J
Jeremius
Guest
It is just my personal opinion, no need to get riled up about it.
Squirrel_killer-
The blade in the dark and the hand at your throat
I'm not getting riled up. I am purely pointing out the obvious facts.
J
Jeremius
Guest
I read the facts, I just think I need more concrete, lore-based evidence, since you and Dagmar seem to love lore so much, to answer the question I asked. It was answered.
Dagmar
Defender of the Bunnies of Skyrim
Why? It's shouldn't be determinative as to whether you support the maintenance of Skyrim as a province of the Empire. It should be enough to know that an independent Skyrim achieved by a Stormcloak rebellion is going to leave all provinces currently not already part of the Aldmeri Dominion more vulnerable to an attack by the same. Whether it's the determinative factor in a player's decision in choosing sides it should be a factor that's considered as pretending that it doesn't exist requires an act of deliberate ignorance and self-delusion.
No one can say with any certainty whether the Empire can conquer the Aldmeri Dominion with only three provinces because there's insufficient information about what's going on within the Aldemeri Dominion itself. I don't believe the Empire is even going to consider launching any kind of offensive against the Dominion for at least another generation at the earliest. Regardless of the status of the Aldmeri Dominion, the lore indicates that 13 years after the war ends, the Empire is incapable of defending Wayrest from being sacked by corsairs or quelling chaos and violence that arise in some of its cities, including Cheydinhal a year later.
Also remember that even with 6 provinces under its rule and a much stronger Imperial Legion under Tiber Septim, it was only when he used Numidium against the Dominion that he was able to conquer it, so it's questionable whether the Third Empire will be in a position to conquer the Dominion even if it regains Hammerfell and the Argonian territories (which now includes Morrowind).
J
Jeremius
Guest
It is a good reason to avoid the war, not enough info to figure things out.
Dagmar
Defender of the Bunnies of Skyrim
That's not logic, it's the opposite of logic. Logic would dictate that if you're setting criteria for choosing a side that you refrain from choosing a criterion which can't be fulfilled until after the fact and the choice is no longer available. There's no way you're going to know if the Empire is going to be able to conquer the Aldmeri Dominion until after it's happened, assuming it happens at all. That's not going to happen until the Civil War is over regardless of its outcome.
That's merely your irrational and unpersuasive opinion.
Dagmar
Defender of the Bunnies of Skyrim
No it's not. It's not even rational.