Imperials or Stormcloaks, what one?

[DrunkenMage]

That would also mean thousands of Thalmor/dominion soldiers died as well, right?

Thousands died on both sides, but the Empire took a beating. If the Empire had 18 Legions they only had 7.5 at the end of the war, if the Empire only had 10 Legions which would make sense since the weakness of the Empire was mentioned prior to the war. They had 3.5 Legions at the end of the war.

I just feel they are not that threat RIGHT NOW.

 

[Rimfaxe96]

Sorry for just joining in, but GIFs are my weakness. ;w;

 

[Sven]

You are both wrong,and this video from ShodyCast on TES lore proves it.Watch around 4:20 for your arguments

watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ

 

[Anouck]

That is the problem, Lore spoken by people is not lore unless it is backed up, to me, anyways. Better to not bother with dialogue and just look at the facts and what ACTUALLY happened. That means that the Thalmor got their butts handed to them by a resurgent Empire in the great war, and were beaten into a stalemate by the redguards, who forced them into a treaty, then out of their homeland, making them not the powerhouses they were when they were winning by surprise.

I was passing thru and just would like to point this out... No disrespect to anyone in particular, however, the above statement isn't very cohesive. You're trying to say that character (lore) dialogue isn't lore and then follow the statement up by stating your opinion and interpretation of the Great War's outcome which is based on your own perspective of related lore.

I see what you mean. I think it depends on when you use what. Like, for instance: if you say 'The Stormcloaks will win the Civil War. Here is a quote from Ulfric Stormcloak. He said it, so it is true' then I don't consider the "lore" an accurate fact. But if you say 'Ulfric thinks he will lose the Great War' and you use a quote from Ulfric where he says he is sure of his victory, then it is relevant information.

It is true that something a character says doesn't have to be true. But in some cases it can be considered a valid argument.

 

[Rimfaxe96]

You are both wrong,and this video from ShodyCast on TES lore proves it.Watch around 4:20 for your arguments

watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ

"The uploader has not made this video available in your country."

Thanks for nothing. And what makes you believe that from all people, including people who've literally studied the TES lore, some guy who just wants to earn clicks is "the savior" who knows everything regarding TES?

 

[Sven]

You are both wrong,and this video from ShodyCast on TES lore proves it.Watch around 4:20 for your arguments

watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ

"The uploader has not made this video available in your country."

Thanks for nothing. And what makes you believe that from all people, including people who've literally studied the TES lore, some guy who just wants to earn clicks is "the savior" who knows everything regarding TES?

Its not even a link to a TES video.Its a Rick roll.

 

[Rimfaxe96]

Its not even a link to a TES video.Its a Rick roll.

Ahh, alright. Couldn't watch it so please excuse me. xD

 

[Raijin]

Its not even a link to a TES video.Its a Rick roll.

Ahh, alright. Couldn't watch it so please excuse me. xD

You've been saved!

 

[Jurgarik Greycloak]

here is an idea: How about the Civil War means nothing and everybody leaves it alone? So they devs can do whatever and not have to mention it?

 

[Sven]

here is an idea: How about the Civil War means nothing and everybody leaves it alone? So they devs can do whatever and not have to mention it?

I think its trying to communicate

 

[Jurgarik Greycloak]

here is an idea: How about the Civil War means nothing and everybody leaves it alone? So they devs can do whatever and not have to mention it?

I think its trying to communicate

Just think about it. The Empire is looking like it is going to fall apart anyways, so the Civil War is pretty moot already if it does. They could easily make it so the Empire loses Skyrim even if it wins the war due to political troubles in Cyrodiil, making Skyrim Independent without war.

 

[Rimfaxe96]

Just think about it. The Empire is looking like it is going to fall apart anyways, so the Civil War is pretty moot already if it does. They could easily make it so the Empire loses Skyrim even if it wins the war due to political troubles in Cyrodiil, making Skyrim Independent without war.

...Only to be crushed by the Aldmeri Dominion soon afterwards, and they lived happily ever after.

 

[Jurgarik Greycloak]

Just think about it. The Empire is looking like it is going to fall apart anyways, so the Civil War is pretty moot already if it does. They could easily make it so the Empire loses Skyrim even if it wins the war due to political troubles in Cyrodiil, making Skyrim Independent without war.

...Only to be crushed by the Aldmeri Dominion soon afterwards, and they lived happily ever after.

OR humanity unites and takes the fight to the dominion, as independence because of political issues does not mean they cannot have an alliance with the other human-dominated provinces.

 

[NENALATA]

Rimfaxe96 said: ↑

Jeremy Stone said: ↑​

Just think about it. The Empire is looking like it is going to fall apart anyways, so the Civil War is pretty moot already if it does. They could easily make it so the Empire loses Skyrim even if it wins the war due to political troubles in Cyrodiil, making Skyrim Independent without war.​

...Only to be crushed by the Aldmeri Dominion soon afterwards, and they lived happily ever after.
OR humanity unites and takes the fight to the dominion, as independence because of political issues does not mean they cannot have an alliance with the other human-dominated provinces.

It is unlikely the Empire of Tiber Septim is going to just 'fall apart'. Even in it's weakened state, the Empire has proven itself to be competent and in no hurry to die.

In all likelihood once Ulfric is defeated, everyone will get the message. However it will take his head in order to do this.

Without the Empire, forget about humanity uniting. Don't look for it, don't expect it ~ Won't happen. The WGC caused too much friction and politics will put too much difference between Provinces, which will break down into Kingdoms once more, without the Empire.

The nations of man will either fix their Empire or they will take a knee to the Dominion who are almost ready for another round at Hoover Dam.

 

[Jurgarik Greycloak]

In the end, I feel that your side in the Civil War was meant to be chosen by which side whose cause you agree with more, and not what the lore/facts/history books tell you.

 

[Rimfaxe96]

OR humanity unites and takes the fight to the dominion, as independence because of political issues does not mean they cannot have an alliance with the other human-dominated provinces.

As Nenalata already said, not gonna happen without the Empire. Human nations have some grudges among themselves as well, you know, and the first ones to actually do something against that and have some sort of union was the Empire (and at the very beginning the Colovians who tried to keep order). Even during the brutal Ayleid rule with human slaves the smaller human "nations" (lore makes them rather sound like tribes) fought each other than the elves who were picking away at their own neighbourhood. Redguards and Nords have a troubled history also, and High Rock had intrigues among the nobility for ages, probably ever since the Aldmeri were chased off and humans took over.
I'd rather see the Redguards going fo Skyrim in case things would go down to seek refugee there 'cause it's geographically advantaged and would kill every Nord trying to stop them from doing so. Either way, the least thing to do now is to rebel against the only thing keeping a slave colalr from your neck or worse.

At the very least wait until after the next war or how long it may take to get that Dominion down.

 

[DrunkenMage]

The Thalmor are sworn enemies of the Empire and everything it stands for. It doesn't make much sense to tear apart what the Thalmor consider a threat, and what they are against the most.

If the Empire falls, Cyrodiil falls. If Cyrodiil falls, Tamriel falls. The White-Gold Tower, is more than just a pretty building, it contains a very special power. The power to stop Mundas dissolving back into Oblivion. You do not want the Thalmor to control it for several years, if not decades. The Empire was lucky they managed to recapture it quickly during the Great War, before the Thalmor were able to obtain stability in Cyrodiil and tinker with what hidden powers are locked away in the tower.

The Thalmor seek to establish a new Merethic Era. That is not something mankind of Tamriel would want, nor many other races. Especially other elves, the Thalmor like to conduct purges on those they consider impure.

Presently the Empire is the only faction that can still pose a threat, hence why the Thalmor have been seeking to undermine the Empire for over 150 years.

 

[Jurgarik Greycloak]

OR humanity unites and takes the fight to the dominion, as independence because of political issues does not mean they cannot have an alliance with the other human-dominated provinces.

As Nenalata already said, not gonna happen without the Empire. Human nations have some grudges among themselves as well, you know, and the first ones to actually do something against that and have some sort of union was the Empire (and at the very beginning the Colovians who tried to keep order). Even during the brutal Ayleid rule with human slaves the smaller human "nations" (lore makes them rather sound like tribes) fought each other than the elves who were picking away at their own neighbourhood. Redguards and Nords have a troubled history also, and High Rock had intrigues among the nobility for ages, probably ever since the Aldmeri were chased off and humans took over.
I'd rather see the Redguards going fo Skyrim in case things would go down to seek refugee there 'cause it's geographically advantaged and would kill every Nord trying to stop them from doing so. Either way, the least thing to do now is to rebel against the only thing keeping a slave colalr from your neck or worse.

At the very least wait until after the next war or how long it may take to get that Dominion down.

The point was that we do not know what would happen, so saying anything is speculation at best, and always wrong at worst.

How about splitting Skyrim into nine "mini-provinces" that can choose who to go with for their own people (The current holds)? That would make everybody a high king and make everybody independently able to choose who they want to rule them, themselves or the Empire.

 

[NENALATA]

Rimfaxe96 said: ↑

Jeremy Stone said: ↑​

OR humanity unites and takes the fight to the dominion, as independence because of political issues does not mean they cannot have an alliance with the other human-dominated provinces.​

As Nenalata already said, not gonna happen without the Empire. Human nations have some grudges among themselves as well, you know, and the first ones to actually do something against that and have some sort of union was the Empire (and at the very beginning the Colovians who tried to keep order). Even during the brutal Ayleid rule with human slaves the smaller human "nations" (lore makes them rather sound like tribes) fought each other than the elves who were picking away at their own neighbourhood. Redguards and Nords have a troubled history also, and High Rock had intrigues among the nobility for ages, probably ever since the Aldmeri were chased off and humans took over.

I'd rather see the Redguards going fo Skyrim in case things would go down to seek refugee there 'cause it's geographically advantaged and would kill every Nord trying to stop them from doing so. Either way, the least thing to do now is to rebel against the only thing keeping a slave colalr from your neck or worse.​

​

At the very least wait until after the next war or how long it may take to get that Dominion down. ​

The point was that we do not know what would happen, so saying anything is speculation at best, and always wrong at worst.

How about splitting Skyrim into nine "mini-provinces" that can choose who to go with for their own people (The current holds)? That would make everybody a high king and make everybody independently able to choose who they want to rule them, themselves or the Empire.

You know, I don't hate this idea. However, a concept such as this is something that will work out well on paper but completely fail when put into practice. Like Alvor said about how things were in, "the bad old days" when Jarls fought amongst each other.

And besides, Markarth and Whiterun already tried this very same thing and failed because they could not compete individually with the more powerful factions. Even if the holds tried something like this ~ Ulfric proved that you've got to have allies and that the other holds will not necessarily respect your good intentions. Jarl Baalgruuf learned this lesson also. Empire proved that in despite of everything, they were patient and exercised good faith in their dealings with independent holds. Tully allowed Jarl Baalgruuf to decide for himself, which is not the mark of true Tyrant.